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I just hope it will have the hp/ amp output to be able to allow truck to tow 8000 lbs over a long distance. 5k towing is not enough
It shouldn't have any impact on towing or payload capacity as its not effecting GVWR/GCWR and it's not changing the battery's performance levels nor is it driving the motors themselves.
 

soedesh

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So what that really means is an additional price increase.
Well, if you're referring to tariffs, that depends on what will be in place at the time that they are actually imported, which may be different from today. Hopefully that gets worked out...
 

colinnwn

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It shouldn't have any impact on towing or payload capacity as its not effecting GVWR/GCWR and it's not changing the battery's performance levels nor is it driving the motors themselves.
So the concern comes from a quick blurb from Scott on Jay Lenos garage that the range extender towing capacity may be 5k. It didn't seem certain and I haven't seen it reconfirmed anywhere else. But it has people up in arms.

There are definitely pathways this could affect the weight rating. The battery reduces from 350 mile range to 150 for the extender. Battery chemistries have a max discharge rate based on size. If the battery is too small even with the generator running there may not be enough power to meet the hill climb requirements in SAE J2807.

Also we don't know the relative weight difference of the engine vs the battery portion it replaces that we've been told is behind the rear axle. Having extra weight out beyond the lever point of the axle where the tongue weight sits could affect the handling.
 
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So the concern comes from a quick blurb from Scott on Jay Lenos garage that the range extender towing capacity may be 5k. It didn't seem certain and I haven't seen it reconfirmed anywhere else. But it has people up in arms.

There are definitely pathways this could affect the weight rating. The battery reduces from 350 mile range to 150 for the extender. Battery chemistries have a max discharge rate based on size. If the battery is too small even with the generator running there may not be enough power to meet the hill climb requirements in SAE J2807.

Also we don't know the relative weight difference of the engine vs the battery portion it replaces that we've been told is behind the rear axle. Having extra weight out beyond the lever point of the axle where the tongue weight sits could affect the handling.
In that case, do you think it'd be significant enough to increase the capacity by a few thousand? I have a tough time wrapping my head around how they'd get that big of an increase but I'm all for it. Fingers crossed it works out for everyone wanting to tow!
 

colinnwn

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In that case, do you think it'd be significant enough to increase the capacity by a few thousand? I have a tough time wrapping my head around how they'd get that big of an increase but I'm all for it. Fingers crossed it works out for everyone wanting to tow!
The target towing capacity for Terra was 10k and Traveler was 7k in BEV form. The reduction Scott implied was pretty surprising. But I'm taking a wait and see. At that big if a weight decrease it makes me think total instant power available is too low for higher weights especially when towing uphill.
 

clabell63

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I’ve got to say I’m disappointed that this can’t be an American made product. Are you locking it into a foreign made item?
 

colinnwn

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I’ve got to say I’m disappointed that this can’t be an American made product. Are you locking it into a foreign made item?
Of course it can be American made. US car companies have been moving production between US, Mexico, and Canada for decades as they treated the North American market as one. Now for the time being they can't do that. But it's too late in the game for building new subcomponent plants in the USA to hit their delivery date if a plant isn't already making an engine, with available capacity, at an acceptable price point. I'm sure Scout did a worldwide search with emphasis on VW options. As Scout launches and builds revenue I hope they look at other options for the generator including innovative engines like LiquidPiston that could be produced in the US.

Ignoring the impact of tarrifs, US made components in the past were more expensive and weren't more reliable, so I was pretty indifferent where the parts are made. But I know it is an important marketing point for Scout.
 

The Vegan

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I for one am glad they partnered with VW for their HREV option. I am confident whichever harvester motor they use from VW will be a solid choice. VW overbuilds their motors and can withstand a lot of abuse. I'm not so sure I would feel as comfortable with the HREV if it were from one of the big three.
 

astricklin

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If ... And that's a big if, the towing capacity is reduced, a big factor will probably be cooling system capacity.

Towing packages on almost every vehicle include increased cooling capacity, especially for the transmission.

Other examples include the F-150 lightning, to get maximum capacity, the towing package adds a second AC compressor for the battery/motor cooling system.

Another example, the Jeep Wrangler, the 3.6 V6 got an upgrade in towing capacity when the grill was redesigned a couple of years ago, this increased airflow and they were able to redesign the cooling system. No changes to the motor/transmission.

With the ice generator for the harvester being tucked away behind the rear axle, I bet that cooling is difficult/ a concern.

I could be wrong but from what I have read and learned over the years, I bet this will be a huge factor if they do have to decrease the towing capacity for the harvester.
 

maynard

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If ... And that's a big if, the towing capacity is reduced, a big factor will probably be cooling system capacity.

Towing packages on almost every vehicle include increased cooling capacity, especially for the transmission.

Other examples include the F-150 lightning, to get maximum capacity, the towing package adds a second AC compressor for the battery/motor cooling system.

Another example, the Jeep Wrangler, the 3.6 V6 got an upgrade in towing capacity when the grill was redesigned a couple of years ago, this increased airflow and they were able to redesign the cooling system. No changes to the motor/transmission.

With the ice generator for the harvester being tucked away behind the rear axle, I bet that cooling is difficult/ a concern.

I could be wrong but from what I have read and learned over the years, I bet this will be a huge factor if they do have to decrease the towing capacity for the harvester.
I just started this thread that could address what you're writing about:
https://www.scoutevforum.com/forum/...-want-the-harvester-engine.13109/#post-180363
 

idrw

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I belive it would be the EA211 1.6 MPI engine. The EA211 series are being made in Silao, but currently I think they are only building the version with turbo (1.4 and 1.5?). It would be pretty easy for them to build the non turbo version of the EA211 which is the 1.6 which is known to be a reliable engine.
 

Dive Bar Casanova

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I read the article. So we’ll get a naturally aspirated four-cylinder engine as the harvester. So those of you who know mechanics and engines, tell us what this actually means in regards to function or power or strategy versus a turbo.
More reliable in the long run. Less costly repairs after the warranty runs out.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BTW:
Tariffs drama will be behind us soon.
 

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Fresh from the "I know it's a pipedream" zone:

I'm increasingly thinking that the better compromise for extending the range while towing is a separate genset mounted on the trailer. Some of the early semi-experimental EVs (like the T-Zero) had an OEM range extending trailer.
There's no reason to carry an engine around for most daily driving.*
But there are at least four problems with this:
1. Current charging schemes provide no way to charge while driving.
2. The charging port isn't in the correct location to connect to a trailer-mounted genset. And why not? Seems to me that the rear center is a better location than the typical side location.
3. Largest routinely available man-portable gensets (~15kW ish) don't produce enough kW to offset average motive power requirement even without a trailer connected.
* 4. Having a range-extending genset on a trailer doesn't help at all unless it's hooked up, i.e., it would not be nearly as convenient as an onboard genset.

Also, I think that if the genset is used to provide energy while in motion, it probably would have to meet the much more stringent EPA emissions for automobiles (vs. the much easier std. for gensets).
 
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When educated creative engineers are faced with a problem the solutions are amazing. With the access to Porsche, VW , Rivian's intellectual property and proven cooling systems through out air cooled 911 to Karman Ghia and VW bug so I am confident Scout has enough experience behind them to figure it out. As to service worries I think Scout will align themselves with an independent EV Service company that Scout sends their vehicles to for pre inspection before client pick up. IE: Service center at which time you are handed a packet explaining this location will. Be your local service center that honors Scout warranty work as well as upgrades and maintenance. As well as providing mobile services for outlying areas and businesses when scheduled in advance. This is what I foresee Hopefully they can have stand alone scout service and distribution centers but if courts keep them from owning them than why not design and build them like you would and re brand them later after dust settles
 
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