Software updates - why is Porsche so far behind.......?

[Greybeard72]

why is Porsche so far behind.......?
Because they can afford it, unlike other "lesser" brands.
I have said it before the fault is the customer, when customers tolerate this sub part product because its a "Porsche" that is what you get, zero effort.
VW has already turned with the ID.1 hopefully Porsche will follow.

Not sure I'd agree. They definitely are behind in both software and hardware architecture .. and, more importantly, the marriage of the two. I am sorely disappointed in the inability of the car to do OTA updates. That, however, does not take away from the pure enjoyment of driving the car. It's a beast and unlike some others here, I have a decent dealer and after 7k miles and a year of ownership, my issues have been at most, minor. I have spared myself the newest update since it doesn't seem to do much and I have very minor issues (rarely). This is my 3rd Porsche (911 4S, MacanS and now the 4S). Yes, they have a long way to go on getting their electronics up to snuff and competitive with Tesla and Rivian. However, if you look at the incredibly long list of issues with Tesla, Rivian and Lucid over the years - and even currently, I would be careful in saying that they are 'flawless' in comparison. Just ask Lucid about their latest update for the Gravity. BMW clearly got the memo (we think - given we haven't seen the production models yet). I spent a good decade of my Tech career getting excellent engineering teams to understand that excelling at software is not just 'an add on'. They never get it. Just ask Blackberry and Sony. No question that Porsche will eventually get the memo even if they have to go through even more pain. Hopefully, the joint project with Rivian will help. Assuming things continue as they are with my 4S, i'll be getting the next version in 2028 after my lease is up. My past experiences with BMW's leaves me cold so I won't be going down that path any time soon. For many reasons, I'm not going back to ICE cars either.

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[Mavshyn]

I asked my dealer about this recent software update. They said Porsche stopped the update because there are cars that will not engage gear after the update. My dealer said there is 1 car at his side that faced this issue after the update.

 

[vanjwilson]

This delayed update aside, I think the Macan software is the best of the non-Tesla EV software out right now.

I traded in a Tesla Model Y after 4 years of ownership for a Macan EV this past spring. I test-drove several other "hatchback" style EVs: Taycan Cross Turismo, BMW iX, and Audi Q6 eTron before deciding on the Macan. In part, I decided on the most expensive option--I was looking at 2022 Taycans--in part because the software on the Macan was the closest to what I was used to in the Tesla.

(And even my Tesla required the occasional soft-reboot of the screen, too. I wish that was one way Porsche wasn't like Tesla. )

 

[Yves]

This delayed update aside, I think the Macan software is the best of the non-Tesla EV software out right now.

I traded in a Tesla Model Y after 4 years of ownership for a Macan EV this past spring. I test-drove several other "hatchback" style EVs: Taycan Cross Turismo, BMW iX, and Audi Q6 eTron before deciding on the Macan. In part, I decided on the most expensive option--I was looking at 2022 Taycans--in part because the software on the Macan was the closest to what I was used to in the Tesla.

(And even my Tesla required the occasional soft-reboot of the screen, too. I wish that was one way Porsche wasn't like Tesla. )

No it isn’t the software is a joke, especially compared to the iX I have. My iX from 2021 has more features in car but also in the App of my iPhone, BMW is like 10 times more useful and has way more details. Just to name 2, manual battery pre conditioning in the car and in the App, yes important if you live in colder regions. It even will pop up battery pre conditioning while using Apple CarPlay and Apple Maps …
The list is long and like with my Tesla regular OTA updates …
Yes the driving dynamics are bare none the best of any EV SUV, but the software is a drama … and will probably the number one reason this will be my first and last Porsche.
I’ve test driven the Zeekr 7X this weekend, and man even the Chinese wipe the floor with the Macan from a software perspective.
Yes the driving / handling they are king, but that is only when you find a place where you can experience that, because in daily driving they all drive the same.

 

[MatC21]

I think vanjilsen has a point though. We exaggerate a little bit how bad the Software is. Yes it isnt great and not worth the price tag but we shouldnt forget how bad car Software used to be - before Tesla set the benchmark.

We also keep mentioning BMW. But BMW is the exception rather than the norm. They do have the best Software out of all European brands for ages.

But drive an Audi, VE or even one of the French cars. You will want your Macan Software back.

 

[Yves]

I think vanjilsen has a point though. We exaggerate a little bit how bad the Software is. Yes it isnt great and not worth the price tag but we shouldnt forget how bad car Software used to be - before Tesla set the benchmark.

We also keep mentioning BMW. But BMW is the exception rather than the norm. They do have the best Software out of all European brands for ages.

But drive an Audi, VE or even one of the French cars. You will want your Macan Software back.

Even the software of my ID3 (I’m on version 5) is better, integration with Apple CarPlay showing AR navigation in the HUD, manual pre conditioning … the app is very basic though … So even in the same group they are lagging. I even left out the slowness of a relative new system … my god it seems like they used a processor from the 90’s

 

[Timcat]

I haven't been here for a while, but I do want to comment on this issue. My Macan is my second EV, my first EV was a Tesla Model 3 Performance. In my experience, my Tesla had at least as many if not more software induced problems than my Macan. However, the Tesla issues, in my view, were a lot worse.

For example, Tesla phantom braking; this happened regularly when using either Autopilot or cruise control, rendering both unusable. For those who don't know, this involves the car slamming on the brakes for no reason whilst using either system on the motorway (highway) and is quite frankly dangerous. Tesla never cured this, despite numerous updates. Useless auto dipping headlights, non-functioning matrix headlights, and useless auto-wipers. They only got the matrix lights working in my last 6 months of ownership. All of these had serious implications insofar as actual driving and safety are concerned.

In contrast, my Macan' s equivalent systems are essentially faultless. I don't care if I can't use my phone as a key and that I get the odd error message, but I do care that my car does not try and cause an accident due to software issues in basic driving related systems. Porsche get the latter right and many of their competitors (Tesla, the update king) don't.

Also, despite being fast, no Tesla handles like a Porsche. OK, the Macan isn't a 911 (I know, I have one) but it gets as close as possible for an SUV.

In short, if you want a car for driving, buy a Porsche, if you want to play with what is essentially a PC (with all that entails - crashing for no reason and so forth) on wheels, get a Tesla or some other computer on wheels.

 

[Colin the Best]

My car was at the dealership for the update at the beginning of December, but it didn't go well; the download stopped at 20% and remained there. I confirm that Porsche has suspended updates, pending clarification.

 

[Peter Fr]

Now rescheduled for Feb 10th

 

[USMA81]

In a recent “race” on the US East Coast, Out of Spec ran several three-row EV’s from Maine to Florida (No Porsche). What stood out for me was that there were software-related issues with many of these vehicles. One Lucid wouldn’t shift into “drive” until they shook the key fob, and even that technique stopped working for them; a fob battery change and car reboot seemed to fix it (who carries a spare fob battery? Why no warning? Who would think of shaking a key fob?). The Tesla wouldn’t charge at full speed until it reached a SOC > 11% and they unplugged and reinserted the charging cable. The Rivian, I recall, had a super hot battery issue and maybe a routing / range issue. The ID Buzz wouldn’t connect to several stations they tried at one charging stop (another Buzz was successfully connected right beside it). The point being, the industry as a whole has a long way to go.



warning, this video is unbelievably long.

I have been fortunate in having only minor issues, and even those have mysteriously gone away. And that’s on two 2024 Macan 4’s I own. I really don’t want the software update. Don’t poke the bear.

 

[seraphmoss]

It’s tech. It’s a computer. It has a sim built in. There is no legit tech reason why OTA couldn’t work remotely. Apologists here are just rationalizing. Car config variations are basic things.

It is reasonable to expect OTA rather than going to the dealership. Everyone else does it.

I love my car but EVs are amazing party because you don’t need to see a dealer much. OTA Software updates are 15 years old at least. To say a modern EV from an amazing brand that includes Audi can’t OTA is just silly.

The main profiles issues are ridiculous too. My account is the only account but it logo in constantly as guest, and I have to do the drop down then login on every start. It’s a bad experience.

 

[daveo4EV]

It’s tech. It’s a computer. It has a sim built in. There is no legit tech reason why OTA couldn’t work remotely. Apologists here are just rationalizing. Car config variations are basic things.

It is reasonable to expect OTA rather than going to the dealership. Everyone else does it.

I love my car but EVs are amazing party because you don’t need to see a dealer much. OTA Software updates are 15 years old at least. To say a modern EV from an amazing brand that includes Audi can’t OTA is just silly.

The main profiles issues are ridiculous too. My account is the only account but it logo in constantly as guest, and I have to do the drop down then login on every start. It’s a bad experience.

it's much more complicated than that - there are a myriad of reasons why Porsche does not do OTA…

but let's start with just 2 big issues (there are many many more):

1. it's not a computer with a sim - it's 100's of computers all over the vehicle…
2. Porsche/VW/Audi do not own the Intellectual Property (IP) rights to the most of the software embedded in their vehicie's from the supply chain…

it get more complicated from there - doing OTA updates no only requires the technology to do them, but the supply chain and manufacturing changes to support OTA updates…

given decades of supply chain logistics, this does not change overnight…any may never change unless a focused business based concerted effort is in place to explicity rid the organization of the legacy methods/business practices that make OTA updates difficult or impossible…

I'm told by people that know that the Macan EV was originally a single ECU design and OTA updates was a top teir feature and it was supposed to be the first Porsche that addressed these systemic issues -this apparently lasted for about 6 months of the nominal 4-6 year design process before everyone realized how much change that actually requires and go cold feet when the dependency list on the supply chain became longer than the expected life cycle of the entire product line…

an organization has to really really really want to do this and be willing to abandon in some cases decades of experience and business process to pull it off…

 

[jwatte]

There is no legit tech reason why OTA couldn’t work remotely.

There are at least two reasons!

First, those updates are pretty big. Porsche would have to pay more for the 10-year data subscription to fit all those updates on the wire.

Second, the system/s are not one integrated system, but a number of components from different manufacturers, that Porsche has integrated. Some of those systems may only be updateable through some slow CAN bus. There's a reason the dealers say "the update takes all day" -- if you got an OTA update, and it disabled your car for 12 hours while it was in your driveway, would you be happy about that? At least when it's at the dealer, you expect it to be out of commission.

Are these *good* reasons that we should be *happy* about? Do these reasons show that Porsche understands customer experience and software development in a connected world? Hell, no! But it is what it is.

 

[seraphmoss]

it's much more complicated than that - there are a myriad of reasons why Porsche does not do OTA…

but let's start with 2:

1. it's not a computer with a sim - it's 100's of computers all over the vehicle…
2. Porsche/VW/Audi do not own the Intellectual Property (IP) rights to the most of the software embedded in their vehicie's from the supply chain…

it get more complicated from there - doing OTA updates no only requires the technology to do them, but the supply chain and manufacturing changes to support OTA updates…

given decades of supply chain logistics, this does not change overnight…

Cool. I asked Copilot for more on your second point. It gave a good explanation, so sharing. I thought it was useful insight:


How Porsche Updates Software at the Dealer

1. They connect your car to a secure diagnostic interface

The technician plugs into:

• ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic Information System)
• Using a VAS 6154A or similar factory interface
• Over Ethernet, CAN, FlexRay, or DoIP depending on the module


This gives Porsche a direct, stable, high‑bandwidth link to every ECU.

---

2. The dealer system authenticates with Porsche’s servers

The dealer tool:

• Logs into Porsche’s backend
• Checks your VIN
• Retrieves the exact software versions installed
• Compares them to the latest approved versions


This ensures:

• No wrong firmware
• No cross‑flashing
• No unsupported combinations


---

3. Each ECU is updated individually

This is the part most people don’t realize.

Your car has 80–150 ECUs, and each one:

• Has its own firmware
• Comes from a different supplier
• Has its own flashing procedure
• Has its own safety rules


The dealer tool flashes them one at a time, in a specific order.

Examples:

• Bosch ABS/ESC module
• ZF steering controller
• LG or CATL battery management system
• Valeo HVAC controller
• Harman infotainment unit
• Continental gateway module


Each supplier provides Porsche with:

• A signed firmware package
• A flashing script
• Safety checks
• Rollback instructions


Porsche does not rewrite these modules themselves.

---

4. The car enters a special “programming mode”

During flashing:

• High‑voltage systems may be isolated
• 12V is stabilized with a charger
• The gateway controls which ECUs stay awake
• The car disables most functions


This prevents bricking.

 

[Greybeard72]

Cool. I asked Copilot for more on your second point. It gave a good explanation, so sharing. I thought it was useful insight:


How Porsche Updates Software at the Dealer

1. They connect your car to a secure diagnostic interface

The technician plugs into:

• ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic Information System)
• Using a VAS 6154A or similar factory interface
• Over Ethernet, CAN, FlexRay, or DoIP depending on the module


This gives Porsche a direct, stable, high‑bandwidth link to every ECU.

---

2. The dealer system authenticates with Porsche’s servers

The dealer tool:

• Logs into Porsche’s backend
• Checks your VIN
• Retrieves the exact software versions installed
• Compares them to the latest approved versions


This ensures:

• No wrong firmware
• No cross‑flashing
• No unsupported combinations


---

3. Each ECU is updated individually

This is the part most people don’t realize.

Your car has 80–150 ECUs, and each one:

• Has its own firmware
• Comes from a different supplier
• Has its own flashing procedure
• Has its own safety rules


The dealer tool flashes them one at a time, in a specific order.

Examples:

• Bosch ABS/ESC module
• ZF steering controller
• LG or CATL battery management system
• Valeo HVAC controller
• Harman infotainment unit
• Continental gateway module


Each supplier provides Porsche with:

• A signed firmware package
• A flashing script
• Safety checks
• Rollback instructions


Porsche does not rewrite these modules themselves.

---

4. The car enters a special “programming mode”

During flashing:

• High‑voltage systems may be isolated
• 12V is stabilized with a charger
• The gateway controls which ECUs stay awake
• The car disables most functions


This prevents bricking.

Completely agree on all the points and firmware issues. Great to see all of the actual detail. Thanks for that. Unfortunately that puts them way behind (newer) so called 'zonal' architectures popular in new versions of EV's coming from BMW and Volvo/Geeli. Innovated by the likes of Tesla, Rivian and Lucid -- adopted by the Chinese, I'm sure.
I am hearing noises that the joint efforts with Rivian and VW supposedly undertaken to actually solve this problem are not doing well .. probably because of the massive clash of cultures and the overhaul of the supply chains that grew up around ECU's. Electretec recently did a review of the new assembly line for Cayenne's. It's clear that innovative directions in Porsche are focused on core automotive engineering and maybe on flexible manufacturing. That doesn't bode well for SDC and OTA updates anytime soon. I saw this play out with both Sony and Blackberry when up against Apple in another life. The outcome was not pleasant for purely engineering based companies. They always view software as an afterthought needing to be retrofitted into their beautiful and superior designs.

I have, so far, no major issues with my Macan 4S and I love to drive it. However, after 3 Porsche's, unless they fix the SDC and OTA issues, I'm afraid this might be my last one. I'm NOT going back to ICE.

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