Latest OutofSpec Dave review - not good

[Fun TC Driving]

Dave has always been a Tesla fantastic. Glad he likes them. True the Macan is not yet perfect but he is saying that the Tesla is that much better by his comparative scoring. IMO some of his individual Macan scoring in specific categories was close to being a hatchet job.

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[JonoNZ]

I love Dave and respect his views, but he really made a meal of this one imo. Negative scores, direct vs dealer, NACS, 1 possible point for safety? WTF? Really not worth placing much weight in the score unfortunately, which is a bit sad.

 

[daveo4EV]

the problem is the rating system "values" software tech - Porsche is going to lose badly on that front…and hence many of Porsche's/VW/Audi's overall problems

they are being attacked on multiple fronts -and frankly watch maker skills (i.e. mechanical engineering) are no longer sufficient to effectively compete in the modern vehicle market…

I disagree with the overall rating, but the sediment is not far off - given the price disparity it's hard to justify the "porsche tax" with a number of glaring deficiencies for a premium brand.

I'm not saying the Tesla is better, but the Porsche isn't as good as it needs to be vs. available offerings - and in particular given the price.

the review is inaccurate with it's weight and focus - but it's not a bad read of the market for less enthusiastic customers that do not fully value Porsche's strengths - i.e. most people can't tell the difference between steering feel, brake feel, and handling while running their soccer errands…

I'm disappointed in the review results, but they are accurate if you focus on where the numbers are going…it's all what you optimize for - and Porsche does not optimize (or cant' optmize) to do well on this particular set of criteria…

I'm personally rethinking my loyalty to the brand (customer/victim since 2008) given their recent short falls and stated focus moving forward…and that's ok - they don't/won't need me - but I'm fairly confident I'm not the only one…

my Cayenne is due for replacement in 2027 - until recently it was 100% going to be a Porsche - well let's just say they no longer have a "lock" on my replacement money - and a lot of it is represented in this review and their corp. focus.

they can keep my 911 money - their clear strength - but they will most likely lose my daily driver money moving forward…but even their new 911's are being priced out of competitiveness for a "sports" car…the premium/price bump for the new 911 GT3 is eye watering and frankly unsupportable - they also have spiked Taycan sales with their pricing, and then complained they are selling fewer EV's…I'm disappointed to say the least.

Dave is not the problem - the fact is Porsche can't pass this particular "test" with flying colors - and argue all you want about the validity of the test, but factually they can't pass it and that's the problem - they used to pass most tests regardless of composition - well that's no longer true…

don't hate the reviewer, don't hate the review, question why Porsche did sooo poorly - and personally I think they've lost focus and don't understand all of this matters going forward. They are being slow to respond to the market - and it's not doing them any good to argue against the flow…

 

[daveo4EV]

the problem is the rating system "values" software tech - Porsche is going to lose badly on that front…and hence many of Porsche's/VW/Audi's overall problems

they are being attacked on multiple fronts -and frankly watch maker skills (i.e. mechanical engineering) are no longer sufficient to effectively compete in the modern vehicle market…

I disagree with the overall rating, but the sediment is not far off - given the price disparity it's hard to justify the "porsche tax" with a number of glaring deficiencies for a premium brand.

I'm not saying the Tesla is better, but the Porsche isn't as good as it needs to be vs. available offerings - and in particular given the price.

the review is inaccurate with it's weight and focus - but it's not a bad read of the market for less enthusiastic customers that do not fully value Porsche's strengths - i.e. most people can't tell the difference between steering feel, brake feel, and handling while running their soccer errands…

I'm disappointed in the review results, but they are accurate if you focus on where the numbers are going…it's all what you optimize for - and Porsche does not optimize (or cant' optmize) to do well on this particular set of criteria…

I'm personally rethinking my loyalty to the brand (customer/victim since 2008) given their recent short falls and stated focus moving forward…and that's ok - they don't/won't need me - but I'm fairly confident I'm not the only one…

my Cayenne is due for replacement in 2027 - until recently it was 100% going to be a Porsche - well let's just say they no longer have a "lock" on my replacement money - and a lot of it is represented in this review and their corp. focus.

they can keep my 911 money - their clear strength - but they will most likely lose my daily driver money moving forward…but even their new 911's are being priced out of competitiveness for a "sports" car…the premium/price bump for the new 911 GT3 is eye watering and frankly unsupportable - they also have spiked Taycan sales with their pricing, and then complained they are selling fewer EV's…I'm disappointed to say the least.

Dave is not the problem - the fact is Porsche can't pass this particular "test" with flying colors - and argue all you want about the validity of the test, but factually they can't pass it and that's the problem - they used to pass most tests regardless of composition - well that's no longer true…

don't hate the reviewer, don't hat the review, question why Porsche did sooo poorly - and personally I think they've lost focus and don't understand all of this matters going forward. They are being slow to respond to the market - and it's not doing them any good to argue against the flow…

my $130k 2024 premium SUV can't do an OTA update for a trivial software update/recall to adjust the brightness of my headlights (something Porsche got wrong from the factory)…so instead in 2025 I'm going to have to drive to my local Porsche dealer (1 hour each way - 4 hours total of my time) and drop the car for an entire day or more - to have a service tech in person - run 1-2 hours of software diagnostics to "correct" probably what as the end of hte day is a set of changes that amount to fewer than 64 bits of 1's and 0's changed in a stored table somewhere in the car's configuration database…

i'm not saying it's the worst thing in the world, but you stake a lot of these "little" short falls up on top of each other - and you start to wonder "why" I'm paying extra money for this product…

and my 11 kW onboard charger apparently does me no good in North America…

my dealer/sales people are often outright wrong about their own product…

their north american EVSE is a certified sh*tshow

corp leadership wants to make more ICE vehicles thinking that will solve their software short falls…

I can go on…

the reviews is disappointing, and quibble with it all you want, but really is it "inaccurate"?

this review is not the problem - it's the fact that a review like this can be produced and we all have to "talk around it"…

Porsche has lost some mojo and I'm deeply sad about that -I have to find another vendor and I'm not sure who does things really well - and I'm not going back to Tesla…so we're stuck

 

[cottony]

the problem is the rating system "values" software tech - Porsche is going to lose badly on that front…and hence many of Porsche's/VW/Audi's overall problems

they are being attacked on multiple fronts -and frankly watch maker skills (i.e. mechanical engineering) are no longer sufficient to effectively compete in the modern vehicle market…

I disagree with the overall rating, but the sediment is not far off - given the price disparity it's hard to justify the "porsche tax" with a number of glaring deficiencies for a premium brand.

I'm not saying the Tesla is better, but the Porsche isn't as good as it needs to be vs. available offerings - and in particular given the price.

the review is inaccurate with it's weight and focus - but it's not a bad read of the market for less enthusiastic customers that do not fully value Porsche's strengths - i.e. most people can't tell the difference between steering feel, brake feel, and handling while running their soccer errands…

I'm disappointed in the review results, but they are accurate if you focus on where the numbers are going…it's all what you optimize for - and Porsche does not optimize (or cant' optmize) to do well on this particular set of criteria…

I'm personally rethinking my loyalty to the brand (customer/victim since 2008) given their recent short falls and stated focus moving forward…and that's ok - they don't/won't need me - but I'm fairly confident I'm not the only one…

my Cayenne is due for replacement in 2027 - until recently it was 100% going to be a Porsche - well let's just say they no longer have a "lock" on my replacement money - and a lot of it is represented in this review and their corp. focus.

they can keep my 911 money - their clear strength - but they will most likely lose my daily driver money moving forward…but even their new 911's are being priced out of competitiveness for a "sports" car…the premium/price bump for the new 911 GT3 is eye watering and frankly unsupportable - they also have spiked Taycan sales with their pricing, and then complained they are selling fewer EV's…I'm disappointed to say the least.

Dave is not the problem - the fact is Porsche can't pass this particular "test" with flying colors - and argue all you want about the validity of the test, but factually they can't pass it and that's the problem - they used to pass most tests regardless of composition - well that's no longer true…

don't hate the reviewer, don't hat the review, question why Porsche did sooo poorly - and personally I think they've lost focus and don't understand all of this matters going forward. They are being slow to respond to the market - and it's not doing them any good to argue against the flow…

Damn I think people named Dave like to give Porsche low ratings

Jk I agree with a lot of your points

 

[JonoNZ]

Slightly unrelated, but I think there is a bit of a reckoning coming with YT content -- the gravy train of creating Tesla content and viewers will come is going to end. There are so many car buyers who are now frankly not interested in Tesla product no matter how good it might be. The only people who will watch are those with Tesla stock, or those that don't care about its CEO or the antics of the company -- but that audience has surely got to be shrinking. I've noticed extraordinary low view counts in recent weeks on some of the OOS Tesla content, too.

Add in the general flux of the automotive industry - so many brands struggling (with both EV and combustion vehicles sales), Tesla eating itself, and the rapid and extraordinary rise of Chinese cars we are in for some very interesting years...

 

[SteveInKirkland]

I agree with many of Dave's points, but I still won't buy the Tesla at any price. And this is the problem with Dave's rating system. None of the issues he cited as negative with the car stopped me from buying it ... and I knew about them in advance. All of my purchase surprises were actually upside surprises.

Before thinking about the upside surprises, think through the mechanical advancements that make driving the car so great compared to a model Y (or even X ... which drives much larger) - the comfort of the air suspension, the more nimble and precise cornering, the more predictable traction control systems, etc. The feel of the car while driving at speed is great and confidence inspiring (compared to its competition).

And the upside surprises for us were all tech ... which we didn't expect to actually work before we bought the car. On our first Porsche, we debated. whether to get a radio in it! But the biggest upside surprise was Innodrive with LCA and adaptive cruise control. We found it to work pretty darn great for us. We also love the HUD and we expected to disable it ... a gimmick for me to try. The third upside surprise was the actual range we are getting from the car, despite 22" wheels. The fourth was how well CarPlay works with the center display and the passenger display. The fifth was the Porsche Charge Planner. All greatly exceeded expectations.

Sure, it is sort of embarrassing that OTAs still don't seem to work well enough. And access to Tesla Superchargers in North America is fairly important to assuage anxiety about travel. And the dealer experience is frequently not good for people. Etc.

The irony to me is that I'm not certain Dave realizes the archetype both his wife and me/my wife fall into that leads us to buy the Macan 4. It's pragmatic, in the sense that you need to drive around to enable you *to do stuff*, but you expect (from years of car buying) a level of interface it-just-works and comfort that Tesla doesn't provide. I think this buyer appreciates the eMacan as a solution to the transportation problems you actually face day-to-day right now and not as an electronics gadget that might someday be safe to allow to drive itself and goes fast in a straight line.

Should you pay a $40k premium over a Model Y to get an eMacan? If you have the money to consider it, what stops you from buying each competitor? For me, the Model Y is just too uncomfortable. The Ioniq 5 has a bad road trip experience (the charge planner, the charge curve, etc.). The Mach E has the same problem, as do many other competitors. The heft of the Rivian R1S eliminates it for us. It's just too big for what some of us need every day. Etc.

For some of us, the electric Macan does well enough to make it worth it to accept the other trade-offs. I didn't think Dave's review really helped you understand whether you fit into the group that would be happy with the car.

 

[evdriver2016]

.
For some of us, the electric Macan does well enough to make it worth it to accept the other trade-offs. I didn't think Dave's review really helped you understand whether you fit into the group that would be happy with the car.

I almost think that Dave totally forgot this. The trade offs are not that bad compared to other really good factors you get. I mean that’s why he ordered it and that’s why his wife loves it.

Those things need some points!

 

[SergeyIndy]

I think everyone focused on the point system instead of listening to Dave's verbal commentary. I found it to be very fair and balanced knowing where Dave is coming from as a consumer. I enjoyed the video and took some notes to share a few comments.

I have never driven a Tesla. I own Macan GTS. Taycan is a daily driver.
I have been test driving RWD, 4, and 4S Macan EV examples for a day each.
Also, keep in mind we are in 2025 with plenty of EV tech already out there.

Tesla Charging - I agree with Dave on why we are not there yet and basically dead last. I understand that the final decision is on Tesla to allow access, but I believe we should have it by now. We know that VW is planned to have access by summer, but this does not mean Porsches will have access. Current EA and CCS charging is lacking in most places and given no more government funding in the US for it, it will only get worse.

AC 19.2kW - I agree, why this is not an option in 2025, yes it requires a 100Amp setup and may be rare use case, but the fact it is not even offered on Macan EV and 2025 Taycan is not right. The tech docs that I have indicate that this may be added later to simplify model launch - ok that is fair.

Tech - I think this is spot on in all categories. Trip Planning is quick. Precondition of battery button is not going to happen as a precaution against being used in the wrong way. UI is bloated and complex, but a lot of features are for one use setup only. OTA is a fair expectation but knowing what Porsche went through with their software providers this is about as good as it is going to get. I am not familiar with Macan EV preheat interior in App interface, but in the Taycan you can choose temp and what seats you want to precondition. Remote App connection and initiation of commands to the car is slow. Bose is by far the worst sounding in any Porshe I have been before and probably the cheapest they could make to still have the name Bose on it.

Drivability - I think this is spot on with my experiences on test drives, but the idea is to get you to go up a trim if it feels too slow what you are driving or if it feels too floaty the point is to add more performance options such as Summer Tires/RAS/PTV+. I did not feel any of the ones I drove felt slow in the city driving, but yes, when you try to launch them, there is no super speed sensation vs. my Taycan Turbo, but that is not the point of a great EV SUV. The One Pedal wish is well understood but again not going to happen since it is a Porsche, end of story.

Ergonomics - I think that was fair as well with great front seats (they said), that I thought are pretty flat to be sporty (14 or 18), and rear is what you would expect from the overall size. They thought it could use more storage for the size, but to me, it almost has too much empty space surrounding the driver.

Buying - You have to have a dealer and a good relationship with them as issues will come up. Value and brand is all personal opinion, so anyone can have their view on that.

Use Cases, Build Quality, and Noise - These were all very specific to their Macan 4 purchase, so everyone will have their own experiences.

Spare Tire - This was also a fair point that an SUV without a spare tire is not ideal as you are expected to venture out to places where you would need a spare. However, to minimize weight and having no space for one, it is not a reasonable expectation to have one. The tire sealant works great if you have a nail, but certainly if you puncture a side wall, that will not help.

 

[Yves]

As many know, I’m very critical of my cars, so much that some wondered if I really had it and was just a troll
I started watching and I could not stand the vibe and over critical on everything attitude.
Yes, the software, especially the app needs work, yes even the Burmester is meh for the price …
But from a driving perspective this is about the best EV out there even beating many sedans (yes I have the Turbo with RWS), it is just insane in handling an acceleration.

Charging, it’s one of the fastest charging vehicles, leave infrastructure out of the equation, it differed for everyone/country/ etc … Most EV owners charge 95% at home and in some parts of the US you can charge this without any issue … and EU, an especially where I live I have like every 10km 800v stalls …

So a car needs to drive like a champ and in case of an EV it needs to charge like a champ
(Porsche give us a pre condition button in car and in the app )

 

[MatC21]

I don’t know how you guys can watch these guys videos. They are absurdly long and keep repeating themselves.

Do not forget that Tesla is struggling in Europe. I am sure their media department is reaching out to every single influencer to push the brand. Just make your own opinions in a test drive.

I do not think you can compare a Y to the Macan. The Macan is leagues above it. At least in the areas which I care about for a car.

 

[Jetced]

I have over 8000km down in the turbo and loved every single kilometer in it. Coming from a Tesla, the Porsche is in every aspect my favorite (except maybe the software, which turned out to be better than expected).
understandably a Tesla Model Y has the better price/value ratio - the Porsche is expensive - but boy I don’t regret it at all!

 

[Greenmachine]

Porsche should buy Lucid for the tech and EV architecture. It would be the best of both worlds.

I’ll never go Tesla but I am thinking a Rivian R3X will be worth exploring in a couple of years

 

[ChrisFromUK]

Porsche should buy Lucid for the tech and EV architecture. It would be the best of both worlds.

I’ll never go Tesla but I am thinking a Rivian R3X will be worth exploring in a couple of years

VW has purchased the Rivian EV Architecture and it will likely show up in products in a few years time. I expect Porsche will be able to adopt it too at some point, maybe in a heavily revised Macan a few years from.

 

[evdriver2016]

I just don't get the Model 3 and Y love. I mean, they are ok cars.

But if you drive and S or X and then go to a 3 and Y, you can feel the big downsize. They are not the same. And Macan is in the S and X class, or even above.

So I don't know how you compare a 3 and Y to a Macan and Macan comes out less. I mean, it's a totally different thing. And there is no way you are sitting in an S or Macan and then going to a 3 and saying, ooh, I'll take the 3!

You are most probably saying - why doesn't this car come with a dashboard display!?! I'll take the Macan!

Sorry, really do like Dave, but I think he almost betrayed his own thinking that he had when he bought the car. There are reasons. Those reasons need points!

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